N/A Tuning for our cars
01-25-2005, 02:06 PM
#11
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Vehicle: N/A as in Not Applicable, not Naturally Aspirated
Yes you can use stock hood, it'll close without hitting. If you want a front sway bar, I've yet to see a GOOD functional one that fits with the Airram. otherwise, you should be fine.
01-25-2005, 03:19 PM
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Vehicle: 2001 Hyundai Tiburon, 2004 Kia Sorento, 2010 Kia Soul
Airram + Strut Bar = Custom Mounts.
No, that won't get you all the way to 175. You'll need some weight trimming, lightweight smaller rims, maybe even some other healthy mods.
No, that won't get you all the way to 175. You'll need some weight trimming, lightweight smaller rims, maybe even some other healthy mods.
01-25-2005, 04:54 PM
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cbehage)</div><div class='quotemain'>Hey Redz just wondering do you think that 175 is at the wheels?
what mods do you htink you need to get there?
CAI
TB
Airram
Hi-Cams
cam gear
pulleys
safc
header
high flow cat
catback
ground wires
Light flywheel
Performance clutch
Can't think of many more...... 1.8 ecu?</div>
Considering a tight budget and the 175 whp goal :
Replace the safc for an smt-6
Install high-comp pistons instead of the clutch
Exclude the ground wires
Instead of the airam/tb, an ITB setup
Injectors
Weitgh reduction (nothing to so with dyno whp but its free and will improve everything, acceleration, handling, braking)
Proper tuning and harmonisation (exaust diameter, cam/pistons/injectors, dyno testing)
With this, you should be there. You could also include head work, crank work, ...to get further.
...Not mentionning everything needed to support this (LSD, clutch, suspension, brakes,....)
what mods do you htink you need to get there?
CAI
TB
Airram
Hi-Cams
cam gear
pulleys
safc
header
high flow cat
catback
ground wires
Light flywheel
Performance clutch
Can't think of many more...... 1.8 ecu?</div>
Considering a tight budget and the 175 whp goal :
Replace the safc for an smt-6
Install high-comp pistons instead of the clutch
Exclude the ground wires
Instead of the airam/tb, an ITB setup
Injectors
Weitgh reduction (nothing to so with dyno whp but its free and will improve everything, acceleration, handling, braking)
Proper tuning and harmonisation (exaust diameter, cam/pistons/injectors, dyno testing)
With this, you should be there. You could also include head work, crank work, ...to get further.
...Not mentionning everything needed to support this (LSD, clutch, suspension, brakes,....)
01-25-2005, 06:07 PM
#16
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Vehicle: Lancer Evo IX
The main thing about NA tuning is port and combustion chamber design, particularly the EXH ports in the case of the Beta. You can blow compression through the roof on C16, but if the ports don't flow enough it's still going to get you a low dyno number. Please look into using the Air Ram and reducing diameter piping towards the TB for a CAI, as this build technique as practiced by HKS does to a sufficient[but NOT great] degree enhance the charge density+charge velocity if ambient temps can be controlled. It should be of constantly reducing diameter, not staggered, and so an experienced welder is needed.
I believe this is the primary reason for going forced induction, but with the restrictive port design, the turbocharger will most likely have to be a hybrid unit or one with a twinscroll rear housing[hybrid between these elements, anyone?]
The Air-Ram is a worthy investment; on a JUN 4G63T longblock, intstalling a JUN IM netted us 280kW at the wheels. And this was on a dead and cracked turbo manifold and a blown out EX side bolt on the 3040 leaking boost like no-one's business and a half-built base map. This was MORE THAN what the car had before, 277kW at the wheels, with much improved response over the stock IM. It will greatly enhance the flow into the cylinders, and thus enable a larger EXH side to be used[read: bigger turbo].
You must be sure though to use constant diameter mandrel and tube sections when building the charge pipes for this effect, and sourcing an intercooler with the same IN/OUT flange dia. as the TB is a difficult task.
Also, one should realise the difference between a powerful car and a fast car; a powerful car will put out huge numbers on the dyno but that's about it. The fast car is the sum of it's parts. It should be well set up and balanced, not only having a powerful engine but examplary braking and suspension tune. The chassis should also be properly stiffened[this can be done without a cage as current manufacturing methods can produce very stiff gussets with reliefs for even more bead area when they are welded in]
Hope that helped.
I believe this is the primary reason for going forced induction, but with the restrictive port design, the turbocharger will most likely have to be a hybrid unit or one with a twinscroll rear housing[hybrid between these elements, anyone?]
The Air-Ram is a worthy investment; on a JUN 4G63T longblock, intstalling a JUN IM netted us 280kW at the wheels. And this was on a dead and cracked turbo manifold and a blown out EX side bolt on the 3040 leaking boost like no-one's business and a half-built base map. This was MORE THAN what the car had before, 277kW at the wheels, with much improved response over the stock IM. It will greatly enhance the flow into the cylinders, and thus enable a larger EXH side to be used[read: bigger turbo].
You must be sure though to use constant diameter mandrel and tube sections when building the charge pipes for this effect, and sourcing an intercooler with the same IN/OUT flange dia. as the TB is a difficult task.
Also, one should realise the difference between a powerful car and a fast car; a powerful car will put out huge numbers on the dyno but that's about it. The fast car is the sum of it's parts. It should be well set up and balanced, not only having a powerful engine but examplary braking and suspension tune. The chassis should also be properly stiffened[this can be done without a cage as current manufacturing methods can produce very stiff gussets with reliefs for even more bead area when they are welded in]
Hope that helped.
01-25-2005, 08:35 PM
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (LarryMcFly)</div><div class='quotemain'>Nice reply but off topic...talking about an N/A setup to reach 175whp. Turbos are nice, but the point of the topic is to get a good result without it.</div>
Whoops, real sorry about that Larry! Let me try:
For 175 at the wheels, about 130 and a bit kW.
You will need headwork and increased valve diameters; the trick is to get the head flowing better and more efficiently so that the rest of the parts will enhance that effect. Hence,
-Port/chamber work
-Cams + cam gears
-reduced thickness gasket, perhaps 0.8 or even 0.7?
-deck the head to up compression
-Install hi-comp pistons and appropriate rings
-Air Ram
-EXH manifold dia. port-matched to EXH port dia. The idea behind this is to prevent resonance and to max out pulse speed as they leave the ports for better scavenging effect. The extractor should integrate a shallow-angle merge collector. The runner length should be equal and section constant.
-High flow cat
-matched diameter catback, mandrel sections only, minimize bends
-UD kit[only if you will run the car at high RPM consistantly]
-Management. Motec's M4[wire-in] at the minimum.
-FPR[try to use a SARD unit as the diaphram design of these allow them to react more quickly to vacuum]
-BBTB: try to use one that isnt too big or else charge velocity will be reduced.
For 130kW the stock coils and wires will be alright, the intake will be an important part since the Air Ram is a large capacity plenium; you will need to have much better charge velocity to fill it at a given engine speed.
The key to this setup is the management system; if you have a tuner who knows what he's doing then 175 won't be a problem, however with the higher comp please look into an oil cooler and radiator as well as a thermostat, and fan control system[the M4 should be able to handle this as well if it is compatible with advanced options package] With the high comp also look into knock sensor. The cams will need to be set properly as well.
Notes: this is to produce the desired power, the rest of the car is up to you.
Whoops, real sorry about that Larry! Let me try:
For 175 at the wheels, about 130 and a bit kW.
You will need headwork and increased valve diameters; the trick is to get the head flowing better and more efficiently so that the rest of the parts will enhance that effect. Hence,
-Port/chamber work
-Cams + cam gears
-reduced thickness gasket, perhaps 0.8 or even 0.7?
-deck the head to up compression
-Install hi-comp pistons and appropriate rings
-Air Ram
-EXH manifold dia. port-matched to EXH port dia. The idea behind this is to prevent resonance and to max out pulse speed as they leave the ports for better scavenging effect. The extractor should integrate a shallow-angle merge collector. The runner length should be equal and section constant.
-High flow cat
-matched diameter catback, mandrel sections only, minimize bends
-UD kit[only if you will run the car at high RPM consistantly]
-Management. Motec's M4[wire-in] at the minimum.
-FPR[try to use a SARD unit as the diaphram design of these allow them to react more quickly to vacuum]
-BBTB: try to use one that isnt too big or else charge velocity will be reduced.
For 130kW the stock coils and wires will be alright, the intake will be an important part since the Air Ram is a large capacity plenium; you will need to have much better charge velocity to fill it at a given engine speed.
The key to this setup is the management system; if you have a tuner who knows what he's doing then 175 won't be a problem, however with the higher comp please look into an oil cooler and radiator as well as a thermostat, and fan control system[the M4 should be able to handle this as well if it is compatible with advanced options package] With the high comp also look into knock sensor. The cams will need to be set properly as well.
Notes: this is to produce the desired power, the rest of the car is up to you.
